Jessica and the Duke: Pages 44- 97

One thing I am enjoying about this book is how naturally important details seem to come up. The narrative truly unfolds within the story, not before it or outside of it. No moments of “Oh my GOD it’s Angela’s identical twin sister! We haven’t seen you since you left for Egypt on an archeological expedition to find King Tut’s remains 10 years ago!” No no… Herbert can do much better than that. At first I thought: the questions that spring up in my mind on page X are addressed by ~ page X+30. But I realized that the answers are coming in pieces, and Herbert doesn’t let any crucial question hang for too long in the air before coming back to it and delivering a detail that gives us insight. The details comes naturally, organically, as if it is- no, it IS a part of the story!

One such detail that Herbert has been gradually explaining is the relationship between Jessica and Duke Leto. At first, I assumed that because Jessica was Paul’s mother and lived with Duke Leto, she was the Duke’s wife. Then she was referred to as the Duke’s concubine, which I was totally perplexed by. Later Duke Leto told Jessica to be thankful that he never married her. After that, Dr. Yueh asked Jessica why she hadn’t made the Duke marry her, and, from her response, we understand the reason: while he remains unmarried, other houses still have hope for alliance.

Since she has born the Duke a son, and the Duke has kept her by his side, she’s more than a sex toy. My understanding of a “concubine” is a long term sex toy, but Jessica seems to be even more than that. I think both Dr. Yueh and Jessica have thought about the fact that she can make the Duke to anything. Now knowing that the Duke devoted to Jessica, and has refrained to marrying her simply for political reasons, I am wondering about what “concubine” means to these people…

Also, with this prediction of the Duke’s death floating around, what happens to Jessica when/if he dies? Does a wife receive more “legal” privileges than a concubine/mother of the heir? And: while the Duke remains alive and single, the other houses have hope. If he dies, how does that affect the standing of his house?

Another side the relationship between Jessica and the Duke pivots on the Duke’s father. What’s the deal here? Why does Jessica hate the Duke’s father? How did he die? Is there something important about the timing of his death, the fact that he died after the Duke was born?

On 0-41 of Dune; 4

On page 8, the Reverend Mother says, "... the gom jabbar. It kills only animals." - RR
I think, Rubi, that the Reverend Mother was trying to be exact but not literal. The gom jabber as I understood it is merely a very quick and deadly poison which the Reverand Mother holds up to Paul's throat; she is the actual judge (killer) who both defines and identifies humanity . (Which is why she is called specially to Caladan to administer the test.)

in the Herbert universe, i don't think the gom jabbar is about overcoming pain or emotion. like the reverend mother says, pain is just the axis of the test, it's about crisis and the discipline to see the bigger picture. the animal will bear terrible pain to save it's own life ... the human will bear terrible pain to play a role in a larger strategy. - AA
What is the difference, in your mind, between "overcoming emotion" and "discipline"? To me they are almost interchangeable.

i think that makes the baron strikingly human, as i'm pretty sure he'd endure whatever it took to take house Atreides down. - AA
Well put. This makes the book more interesting, as before I was under the impression that human was equated with good, and therefore there would be nothing more to learn from the book. With this view, the book may be exploring humanity and trying to understand the factes of both emotion and reason.

On 0-41 of Dune; 2

Herbert has created this space-going society that we can't really place definitively in one of the distant future or the distant past. it could be either and it's a little bit of both, right. it's feudal, it's patriarchal, it's mystical, it's about family and rites of passage and vendetta and prophecy ... and the book has barely started.
It's interesting to me that you try to place this book in our world and our own reality. I find that more often than not I am so completely engaged in a story, sci fi in particular, that I forget about the world that I live in unless the book explicitely makes references to obvious real history or facts. For example, countries, like in Ender's Game, or people, like in The Alienist. If I had to pick a time for this book I would categorize it into what I think of as, for lack of a better term, future's future: thousands of years ahead of today, in the aftermath of society's prime. In my head, this category is largely dominated by book where the reality is at odds with our reality in that there is a society that is either unlike anything we've recorded -- "futurific" -- or similar to distant history -- "primitive" -- and this society is juxtaposed with a technology level that is the opposite, e.g. society is futurific and technology is primitive, or visa versa. Does that make sense? I realize this was not your argument but I was struck by the idea of trying to place it in our reality at all.

shoot ... sometimes i want to say the Litany Against Fear it's such a great mantra.
Word. It is the one thing that stayed with me to this day from reading the book long ago. In fact, I actually forgot where I heard it. (Also forgot it verbatim but the idea of it haunts me from time to time so I'm glad I finally found it again.)

as for whatever it is the bene gesserit are doing ... i think all we can say at this point is
Ah, you write with knowledge of more of the book than I have. (i.e., What the fuck is "germ plasm"?)(Don't answer that.)

any thoughts on the spice?
Quick thought: I maintain that the Baron's Mentat is not "human" (as defined by the BG). Mentat are by definition logical and goverened by reason. How then, is he addicted to a spice? He must be fallible...